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So he didn’t quit the band three days in a row after saying he would. Hasn’t seemed himself, been with it at all.

We spoke last night. He’s having the same mental health problems he was having before which I won’t go into but were serious enough that he ended up in hospital. No I don’t think he’s lying about that because I can see it and have noticed it coming back over the last few weeks/months.

His new proposition (but he has said if I choose to end things he’ll go without a fuss and leave me alone) is:

* straight back to the drs and back on his medication (doing that today)
* IC immediately (which he’s fought against the whole time)
* having a conversation with band members so that they treat his alcoholism the same way as the other guy - with respect and concern and intervening if needed.
* straight back to hotel rooms after gigs

He’s also suggested looking for a different job that is only UK based and less gigs.

I feel like my emotions are getting in the way of me thinking about this properly. I feel like he let me down again by not doing as he said. I feel like I’m second best to his job if he’s willing to leave me as long as he can stay in his job. I feel like he can’t love me the way I need him to.

I also know that I am in an incredibly emotional state right now and it’s probably not a good idea to make big decisions, but that I am struggling with living with him. I don’t want a temporary split because I think that would make things worse. I want to make a decision and move on with my life but I don’t feel like I have the energy, mentally or physically, to do so.

He’s offering what I was asking for before but it feels like maybe it’s too late? I don’t know if I can accept it anymore.

I’m also obviously concerned about his wellbeing now. I’m wondering if maybe the IC will help and have a knock on off effect in helping the relationship.

Am I just being stubborn and refusing to accept what I’ve been asking for? I’m thinking of seeing how it goes. I’m worried that he’ll make the changes away from me and then I’ll see that and regret not trying again.

I just really don’t know what to do.

It must be difficult to see your WH struggle with mental health issues. It is certainly confusing that he would agree to things above and beyond what you asked originally, go back to bargaining with you and suggesting other solutions, and also say he'd be fine if you wanted to end things.

Bargaining and going back on promises is not a good sign for real change. Among other things, it indicates that he thinks he has multiple chances. Also realize that right now you alone are advocating for the family, finances, and children. He is advocating for himself and his interests.

This is concerning:

* having a conversation with band members so that they treat his alcoholism the same way as the other guy - with respect and concern and intervening if needed.

It indicates that he is not accepting that sobriety is solely his responsibility. Why should his band mate's make it their problem?

Question: What do you think he would do if you initiated divorce? How would he handle his life and his relationships with you and his children? I think maybe that is the biggest predictor of his future behavior. What about separation? You could let it be known that it is a final chance to prove himself. How would he act?

I'm concerned that it looks like he repeatedly fails to meet commitments and you keep moving your boundaries.

I'm more concerned that he seems to offer things he needs to do for himself as incentives for you to stay - i.e. he'll take care of himself only if you agree to stay.

I wonder if he's making you his parent and thereby putting responsibilities on you that he needs to take on for himself.

If I'm seeing him right, he's a lousy candidate for R.

And - this is an observation, not a criticism - you're not in shape for R, either, because you appear to be unable to set and maintain good boundaries for yourself. That's a problem you can solve, though. You can't solve his problem.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:00 PM, Friday, September 20th]

I agree with sisoon.

His new proposition (but he has said if I choose to end things he’ll go without a fuss and leave me alone) is:

* straight back to the drs and back on his medication (doing that today)

* IC immediately (which he’s fought against the whole time)

* having a conversation with band members so that they treat his alcoholism the same way as the other guy - with respect and concern and intervening if needed.

* straight back to hotel rooms after gigs

He’s also suggested looking for a different job that is only UK based and less gigs.

I see this as a way for him to placate you while remaining with the band, which is really just another form of cake-eating. It's a shitty cake with a fear-and-manipulation filling (I'll leave you alone; woe is me; I'm a martyr) and a little hopium sprinkled on top (I'll look for a new job). Especially since this is what you asked for before and he refused.

You're acting out of fear. I think you need to figure out what you want - not the minimum that you're willing to accept, but what you WANT. And I also think that separation is exactly what you need. You're so wrapped up in trying to manage him and reacting to what he's doing and he doesn't seem to be too interested in doing any of the work needed to become a safe partner. At least not uncoerced. I truly think that you need to take your focus off of him and redirect it to healing yourself and doing what's best for you.

[This message edited by SacredSoul33 at 4:42 PM, Friday, September 20th]

You know what you want and it’s him leaving the band, getting a job which is equal in pay to yours, and for him to be a responsible parent and mate.
Is he doing any of that? There’s your answer.

There's a silly old joke I heard when I moved to the southern US.
Question: How do you stop a Southern Baptist from drinking all your beer when you go fishing?
Answer: You invite two of them.

It's not a critique of their religion. It's a commentary on the type of person who will only do the right thing when someone is there to hold them accountable. They lack inner accountability. Your WH gives off that vibe. And at some point, he will be in a situation or several where no one is there. That's not your responsibility.

You know what you want and it’s him leaving the band, getting a job which is equal in pay to yours, and for him to be a responsible parent and mate.

Exactly this!!!

The only thing I have to add is this:

You might be willing to compromise on what you're willing to tolerate from him as a partner, but you should never compromise on what you expect of him as a parent.

Will leaving him make him a better parent? Probably not. But at least you would no longer be modeling a lousy relationship to your kids and won't feel obligated to make excuses for his failures as a father.

It indicates that he is not accepting that sobriety is solely his responsibility. Why should his band mate's make it their problem?

Maybe I didn't explain that bit very well. It's not that he's saying it should be their problem or responsibility. He's been friends with one of the members since they were teenagers, he's a bit younger and I guess it's peer pressure but if my partner says he's not going out/drinking, he'll pile the pressure on. What he means by having that conversation is he wants to make sure the other guy stops doing that and is aware that it's an addiction that he's struggling to control and make sure that his friend no longer behaves that way about it. Also I guess for extra reassurance, he was talking about the sober guy and that they know if they see him drinking that he's in trouble and would try to step in to help.

Question: What do you think he would do if you initiated divorce? How would he handle his life and his relationships with you and his children? I think maybe that is the biggest predictor of his future behavior. What about separation? You could let it be known that it is a final chance to prove himself. How would he act?

After the conversations we've had recently, I think he would concentrate on his mental and physical health and getting his finances in order to support himself and our kids (which he's already started doing).

I'm concerned that it looks like he repeatedly fails to meet commitments and you keep moving your boundaries.

This is one of my concerns too.

I see this as a way for him to placate you while remaining with the band, which is really just another form of cake-eating.

I'm not sure about this because this mental health problem scares him because of how bad it got before so I think these are steps he would take anyway right now to prevent it from getting worse.

You know what you want and it’s him leaving the band, getting a job which is equal in pay to yours, and for him to be a responsible parent and mate.
Is he doing any of that? There’s your answer.

He's actually starting a new job next week (as well as the band but a 'normal' job) and he'll be earning more money than me. He's also suggested looking for a band that's UK based only and way less gigs.

I have read through all this twice. And very gently it sounds like you are setting yourself up for "lather - rinse - repeat"

That he'll "get himself together" long enough to get you off his back.

You aren't his parent, preacher or sponsor. Nor should you assume any of those roles.

And he shouldn't weaponize him taking care of himself and being a grown up.

ETA - the fact that you have to keep moving the goalposts of your boundaries should be a clue.

[This message edited by Chaos at 8:27 PM, Friday, September 20th]

Ok. I see his viewpoint with the band differently than he does.

* having a conversation with band members so that they treat his alcoholism the same way as the other guy - with respect and concern and intervening if needed.

This statement, and your clarifications, implies to me that your WH is fully aware that the band and the environment on the road is not healthy or conducive to him being a sober, healthy, man who behaves with integrity and a good, faithful husband and father. Taking responsibility and accountability would be him acknowledging that how he handles that fact is solely his responsibility, not the band or his friends. He would quit the band.

And he needs special treatment because he's younger than his other band members? ugh. He is an adult. I'll introduce you to another southern US expression: "He's full of more shit than a Christmas turkey."

Why not separate and let him prove on his own that he can do this before you will take him back as an equally accountable husband and father?

[This message edited by KitchenDepth5551 at 9:27 PM, Friday, September 20th]

I was talking about the other band member who’s younger than them, not him. And it’s not special treatment, it’s just getting them to respect what he’s saying like they do with the other guy who is a recovering alcoholic. They never ask him to hang out after the shows because they know it’s a no-go situation because of that. He’s asking for them to respect what he’s saying in the same way and being open about it.

Separation isn’t easy. We live in an area where rent prices have doubled in the last few years and are way beyond what a normal income can afford you. Most single people have to flat share, which is not an option with kids. I’m very lucky with my house that the landlord is someone I know and has never and will never raise the rent. I pay less than half of the average rent in my area. It’s also a minefield trying to navigate childcare around two jobs. It’s not as easy as just separating for a while.

We’ve discussed it further, he’s booked a drs appointment, booked his first IC session, already had a conversation with his band members and laid down that he will not be going out after shows and why, and he’s agreed to look for a different musicians job closer to home, which he’s told his boss he’s doing. He’s also dipped out of the longer trips for the rest of the year so it’s just one nighters in the UK for now and like I said he starts a new ‘normal’ job next week, one that he’s chosen because it’s flexible around my hours and means he can do still do school pick ups, which he does every day that he’s not away whether I’m working or not anyway.

I think our best bet for now is doing what I said before. He works on himself, I work on myself and watch whether he is sticking to what he said and if he’s not, by the end of the year he’ll be in a better financial situation to leave now that he has this new job.

You’re getting great, solid advice and observations, user. As sísoon and others have pointed out, NONE of what is on his list is anything that he shouldn’t be doing as an adult addressing what he needs to for his own mental health and financial support.

So here’s another question: What on the list is something that JUST you need for your own support and care from your partner? The one solid thing that you have said you wanted and needed was for him to get out of the band. Period. And that is not on this list that is supposedly what he’s willing to do. He’s said he was getting out several times only to backtrack and go back to bargaining. So where in all of this is anything about you and what he’s put you through and what you’ve said you need to reconcile?

This is all what he should have been and should be doing ALWAYS as a healthy human being, a father, and a partner. Often we accept just some semblance of what our partners should have always been doing as some huge concession and gift. It isn’t. Especially not after infidelity.

The supporters here who are making observations about your moving goal posts are giving you something that you maybe should look at. Maybe go back to your list of what you said you absolutely needed for you not to send him to his mom’s a week ago or two weeks ago. Is ANY of that something that he’s agreed to unconditionally do for you?

He’s basically just agreed to address his own mental health issues (and hasn’t started that yet) and to help with more financial support plus keep the band.

Gently, HE shouldn’t be setting the list of what he’s WILLING to do now for you He’s bargaining and you’re letting him redefine what you’ll accept when you laid your conditions out for yourself and him very clearly.

You can’t control him (obviously). You can only control and work on you to help you move forward in a healthier way.

As has already been observed, you’re setting yourself up for lather, rinse, repeat. My experience and what is revealed over and over here is that compromising on your needs after being cheated on in order to keep a partner that you think maybe might possibly be taking the need for change seriously in the expectation that he will get himself all together and be a great partner is a really iffy risky business. The usual result is that you will look back and wonder why you didn’t stick to your guns and put yourself first.

I know you’re worried about your kids’ father and the partner that you have had an image of for a long time (as well as the very real one you’ve been living with). I know you’re trying to keep things steady for everyone. Keep working and processing. This shit takes time. Just don’t sell yourself out and don’t be evasive with yourself because of hopium.

Easy to say, I know. We’ve all been there. No judgement here. You will get there, but your current thinking may keep you in pain and trauma longer than other routes. It’s your path. We’re just here to help.

[This message edited by NowWhat106 at 1:42 AM, Saturday, September 21st]

I have to agree with sisoon…

Coming from a situation very simialr to yours , my H was a die hard music lover who thought he would never survive without being in a band. I gave him the ultimatums and I told him I was tired of carrying his weight and having him around the sex and drugs , I don’t care what anyone says it comes with the territory , I’ve seen it for 15 years.

Even if he would have gotten a better job (he did) and told me he would still stay in the band I would have fled. But he didn’t, he left that day.

Those are MY boundaries and I think at one point they were yours too. I whole heartedly believe if I moved that boundary and expectation after I set it then I would have been setting myself up for failure. There isn’t any meeting partway in reconciliation, it is all or nothing when it comes to what YOU need to heal with him.

I say this with a lot of compassion and empathy for you because I can relate a lot to your story. I hope you do what is best for you and you don’t waiver from what you need.

[This message edited by Groot1988 at 12:23 AM, Saturday, September 21st]

I have a super busy day but just wanted to jump on quickly.

He's given his notice to his boss that he'll be leaving at the end of the year (gigs finish for the year beginning of December) and like I said, dipped out of the longer trips abroad, so just UK shows, most of which he can drive back after. He's still going to look for one in the UK but one that's UK only and less shows, so maybe one or two a month where he can come home after, and it will be discussed before he accepts anything to make sure it's something I'm comfortable with. If he can drive home after the shows, I have no problem with that. It's the being away that I don't like.

The things he's doing just for me are things I didn't put on the list like open access to phone/devices (he was doing that anyway), location sharing, and the above is for me not him because he would continue to stay in that band while working on his mental health if it was all about him.

I don't know, it feels like he's done a lot of positive stuff in the last few days (like the above, booking IC, booking a drs appointment) and obviously I can't convey a whole conversation on here. I don't want anyone to think I'm blindly accepting it all and diving right back in like everything's fine. I'm cautious. But it's a lot of what I see as positive change in a few days. And he's acted on everything he's said he'd do immediately, like booking the drs appointment, booking therapy, starting a new job, discussing his issues with the band, dropping out of abroad shows and doing ones that he can mostly drive home after, handing in his notice. And he has done all of that while running the house and solo parenting while I've been doing long hours at work all week (yes expected, but I'm sure a lot of us now how hard is it to solo parent while struggling with mental health issues and big life changes).

So I'm cautious, but I'm not going to ignore the positive stuff. I'm not going to cling to it blindly either. It's just a start in what I see as a positive direction. Like I said, it's not the band/job itself that bothers me, it's when he's away from home so if he's able to come back after shows, that's fine with me.

It sounds like you’ve made peace with your decision, at least for now. I hope it works out for you.

I haven’t really made a decision. Separating isn’t financially possible right now anyway, I only wanted to send him to his mother’s if it was completely necessary as the kids can’t stay there. So if he’s doing these steps, I’ll still be seeing how things go until the end of the year. I’m not making any final decisions just yet.

I'll tell ya ... IMO, getting sober and dealing with his mental health ARE what he needs to do to change from cheater to good partner.

If you're not addressing your compromising your boundaries in IC, my reco is to talk about it here and in IC. Making a conscious choice to change a boundary is likely to be OK. Letting someone batter you into changing your boundaries against your will is not.

But if you can't maintain your boundaries now, you can learn to. Just be aware of what side you're on, and if you don't like what you do now, change. You can do it.

To be honest, I hadn’t considered that I might feel differently about a different music job. But if he can come home mostly after and he’s doing the other stuff too, I do feel okay with that idea. So that’s why I moved my boundary there - another option came up that I hadn’t considered. If I know he’s coming home right after a show, which he has done more often recently, I instantly feel better about it.

My therapist has moved the focus of our sessions from the relationship itself to just me. People pleasing has come up a lot and putting other people’s needs before my own.

Hi,
I ran away from this site for a while, it’s overwhelming sometimes when you hear things that may be true but you don’t feel strong enough to cope with yet.
I hope no one feels judged when I say this… in terms of staying or going or separating, that is your choice and I really don’t think anyone will judge you if for now you choose to stay because you aren’t ready or equipped to do anything else. I really empathise with that.
My concern for you is that you’ve already been through a LOT, and for him to be struggling with his mental health, that’s a big weight to add to your already heavy load. I’m not saying I don’t believe him, I do however feel it’s come at a convenient time in terms of a guilt trip for you. I wonder if he has as much concern for your mental health as you have for his? You are incredibly kind to be so worried for him. I think he knows that this will worry you. I’m sure it will make you feel protective over him to feel any sense that people think he’s taking advantage of you with this. Like I say, I’m not disbelieving him, who am I to? I don’t know him or his struggles. But it does seem a pattern that he leans on you for most things.
I suppose what I’m saying is, if I was to give you advice, if you want to stay because you still want to give it a go and you don’t feel separation will work because of all the financial problems, stay and hold your head up high because that is your decision and it’s empowering to make a strong decision one way or another. I would work really hard on not taking on the responsibility of his mental health and his addictions though. As others have gently said, he needs to take responsibility for them himself. You aren’t putting all your mental health woes on him to sort out. I would tell him that you are not changing the goal posts for him or bowing down to his demands. Tell him what you expect, such as you will stay with him for 1 month, he has to look after his mental health and addictions himself and you need to see strong evidence of the steps he’s taking. Say that you are going to live your life, try to enjoy it and reevaluate in a month. Show him that you are still making the calls, you are still the victim of all of this, not him.
This is a very sensitive subject and I don’t know if I’m allowed to talk about this, so apologies if I overstep, but if he ever does anything to hurt himself please don’t feel that is your responsibility. I worry that he holds a power over you in that way, you being clear on what you need and what your expectations are , are not any reason for him to say he’s spiralling mentally. You are allowed to say these things and not to have to fret. You could be in just as vulnerable a position and he’s still taking risks with your happiness.
Again a long winded message, I don’t think I’m as eloquent as a lot of the posters. Just stay strong, stay level headed, and keep reversing the situation as I said in a previous post. I don’t think there is any time line on having to come to any decision unless you need to. That doesn’t make you weak. Just make it clear you aren’t giving in to him, you are just giving yourself time to make a calm choices.
Wishing you the best.

As you can see, his words mean nothing.

He has a problem ( alcohol) which puts him in a place of not making the best decisions.

If I were you, I’d put my full weight on the fact that he cannot be trusted (based on past behavior) and he will say and do anything right now to get what he wants.

I suggest you get some professional help to sort through what is best for you. Enabling him should not be one of the options btw. And it feels like you might be making a bargain with the devil IF he’s not enrolled in an intensive sobriety program like AA.