SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

April 17th was my D day. The day i wrote everything i had seen in 22 years of marriage and realized i was not crazy. I had not imagined things. She had had multiple affairs and sexual betrayals for our entire marriage. The first was just months after we said our vows with my best friend, on the couch while i dozed in our bedroom waiting for her to come back from "getting a drink of water" for 10 minutes.

so many discoveries.
1st year of marriage -

2 years into our marriage she planned a sex vacation where she spent 8 nights visiting her cousin and husband and doing threesomes with them every night.

and then there was her boss . i knew the first time they had sex because she came home guilty and fawning after a late night meeting.

each time she got better and better at hiding. deleting texts, etc. i dont think she stopped, she just got less sloppy.

A year ago i found mens underwear in her car. when i asked her whose it was she refused to answer and changed teh subject. twice.

now i am in so much pain. my initial feeling from the initial realization that i was not crazy was peace. i thought from that we could come to talk about it and heal after grieving together.

I spent a lot of time preparing a loving script to have this hard conversation. telling her nothing would ever change how much i loved her and how we needed to talk about our past and not hide from it.

She got into my computer and read it. she had answers for every question before i even finished the questions. she was gaslighting me, enraged and telling me i was delusional and i so desperately wanted to believe that i was wrong that somehow i had been mistaken. it was too surreal. how could she possibly do all these things. i crumbled. i told her i believed her and i did in the moment.

Since then ive come to realize that she gave herself away 5 times before she had finished talking. Even just the fact that she searched for my script titles "conversation with love" and used it as a weapon against me.

I'm in so much pain and i cant bear the fact that we might never talk about the truth. i have been living in a lie for 22 years while she has fucked and sucked her way through our marriage with other men.

i still love her unconditionally. there is nothing that can change that. but i want to know her. i want to grieve this together and try to rebuild something.

peaceandcalm,

based on everything you said, WHY would you want her back?

My heart breaks for you. Please, please don't let her get away with this any longer. There is something deeply troublesome in her that only she can address. She is not safe for you and I can't imagine she ever will be.

Please take care of yourself.

You posted here a couple of months ago, then just kind of dropped off of our grid. Did you address this with her like you'd planned? You had talked like you were ready to end things if it came down to it. Where's your head at now?

I agree with funnything. I know you love her, but love alone isn't enough. Especially if it's one-sided. I think you could do with some serious counseling to figure out why you let her do this to you. Someone with your capacity for love and compassion deserves so much better.

Most of us have been in your shoes to some degree. There's a good group of folks here who understand your pain. We hear you, man. You're being heard. Stick around and don't disappear on us. We actually do care and want the best for you.

That’s really difficult peaceandcalm.

In your first thread (https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums/?tid=667001), I was really concerned about you confronting her with very little evidence.

She did what one would expect of a cheater - she lied, gaslighted, the whole thing.

As I pointed out then, she’s been lying and gaslighting you for decades. She didn’t even answer your question about the underwear you found in the car!

I had suggested that hiring a PI would be a path. And that’s a way to catch what she’s doing now. But you’re right: you might never get the truth.

That sucks so much!! So many have trod that path. Dealing with people who will not, or frankly cannot, come clean. She’s one of them.

She’s still cheating with her boss, right? There are two moves that seem to work when there’s a live affair: exposure and leaving.

Exposure means exposing her affair to the Boss’s wife, her family, other important stakeholders. Maybe even HR. Leaving means leaving. Sometimes that snaps people out of their fantasy worlds and they fight hard to salvage their marriage. Sometimes they just leave. And sometimes, most cruelly of all, they just pretend to do that, but drive the A underground. I have your WW in that last group if I had to bet.

I’m so sorry for your pain.

I'm sorry you are going through this, you have to let go and be willing to lose her. You need a hard 180 and get yourself out of infidelity. Loving her unconditionally will get your no where, I wish you the best but you cannot tip toe through it.

You cannot work through it together if she is not willing to work through it. Also , did you mean she was having sex with her cousin?? Wtf . She clearly has a lot of deep seated issues that you Dannot fix through love. Unfortunately loving someone unconditionally without consequences will just allow them to continue to cross your boundaries over and over again. I agree with what was said above. You need to be able to face losing her - there is no chance at reconciliation if you sweep it under the rug and let her get away with it without any consequences

Words and phrases matter because when we use them we can define how we think and how we evaluate a situation, and that’s why I’m emphasizing what you say here:

i still love her unconditionally. there is nothing that can change that

Friend – if you love her unconditionally then why are you making a requirement of fidelity? A requirement is a condition – therefore not unconditional… In fact – why are you expecting fidelity if your love for her is unconditional and nothing can change that?

I guess fidelity was an expectation in your relationship, as evident by her being secretive about her affairs. No need to be secretive if she didn’t think you expected monogamy, is there? If she were to tell you that nah… fxxx it… she doesn’t want that monogamy stuff and wants to open up the marriage… what could you do SINCE you love her unconditionally and nothing can ever change that? I guess you could only go along and hope she at least be indiscreet and uses protection.

Does that sound good?
If not – then really redefine how "unconditional" your love is…

I am NOT saying this in any way to get you to divorce.
We don’t know enough about you, her and your marriage to give any direct advice on if you should reconcile or divorce. What we do know is that a) she has repeatedly cheated and b) it’s hurting you (as evident with you posting on a forum like this). We can also guestimate with alarming accuracy that since this is repeated long term behavior it’s not likely to change without some drastic action. I can tell you 100% certainty is that NOTHING will change unless you demand and make changes.

That starts IMHO by removing the "alas! Woe me!" mentality of "unconditional love" and "can’t imagine life without her" drama and restart with a clear mind about what the worst possible outcome of this situation might be, and the acceptance that your love for her is conditional.

I put this to you: The absolute worst outcome won’t be that in six months from now you might be starting on the process of divorce. The absolute worst outcome is that six months from now you find another pair of men’s underwear in her car, or get a STI, or find some pics on her phone… or whatever else might let you know it’s still going on.
Sharing her is worse than losing her.

Once again: Not saying you should divorce. But you need to be able to confront her where you aren’t questioning if she’s cheated or cheating, but STATING you know she’s cheated or is cheating, and demanding an answer from her if she wants this marriage or not.

Assuming she states she does, then you can question what she’s willing to do to save it, and work from there.

But the moment you believe your love for her is totally unconditional and you cant live without it… you have trapped yourself in ongoing infidelity.

Friend, your perspectives are honestly self-defeating. I think that in your situation it would be good to ask yourself a few questions. "Do I stand up for myself enough? Do I create harmonious relationships based on reciprocity? What drives my life and relationships? Do I own responsibility for my destiny? What are my fears? Why?". You can't control your wife and force her to be honest or faithful. The only person you can control is you and the journey out of infidelity is your journey. Take care.

[This message edited by Itiswhatitis000 at 6:09 PM, Wednesday, September 23rd]

You are right that i have trapped myself for 20 years . I do love her unconditionally .there is nothing i can do about it. And many times yes, i do feel like i cant breathe without her. I do not stand up for myself enough.

i can see that there are hard choices to be made. i cant stop loving her but that doesn't mean we get to stay married .

She is still reacting like i was the one who did her this horrible wrong by asking her about her affairs. how could i not know her? how could i think she would be capable of this? So much that even now i doubt. i wonder. what if im wrong?

I dont see the path through. I thought it was through talking openly and reconciliation. grieving together but i think its becoming clearer that may not be possible for her. My heart is broken .

Thank you all for your words. i really appreciate you taking the time to share your insights. Some of this stuff i really needed to hear. but im still terrified of what comes next.

One way to stop hurting, besides counseling is to employ the 180. https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/documents/library/articles/discovery/understanding-the-180/

Read the FAQs.

This is to help you detach from her. Sometimes it has the effect of getting her to "come to the table" so to speak, but that’s not the point of it. Right now your feelings for her are paralyzing you. The 180 should help to free you.

peaceandcalm

i cant bear the fact that we might never talk about the truth.

This really landed with me because I am dealing with something similar although the circumstances are different...the betrayals in my marriage were many years ago but I only found out recently and one of the hardest things I am sitting with now is that he does not want the infidelities or affairs spoken about again and think there is a particular kind of pain in finally understanding that you were not imagining things and then still not being able to have the honest conversation you thought that truth might finally make possible...you spent years doubting yourself and now even with what you know you are still being pulled back towards doubting your own reality.

i cant stop loving her but that doesn't mean we get to stay married .

I think this is such an important distinction and one I am learning myself...loving somebody and being able to live safely honestly and peacefully with them are not necessarily the same thing. You do not have to stop loving her today to start protecting yourself or to recognise that you cannot grieve and repair a marriage alone and understand wanting to grieve together because that was what I thought healing would look like too...but I am slowly learning that if one person refuses to look at the wound then the other person can end up carrying all of it. Please do not mistake your need for truth and conversation as you doing something wrong to her - after everything you have discovered you are allowed to need reality - you do not have to know what comes next today...but I hope you start giving the same compassion and loyalty to yourself that you have clearly given her for so many years.

My Friend,

You are in a highly abusive situation and need some intense therapy. I can say with some level of confidence that she does not love you. And in all honesty, I wonder if either of you know what real love is supposed to be.....??? I have my doubts.

You are experiencing co-dependence to your abuser. This is the same effect women often have to men that physically abuse them.

There is light out there, please believe us. You need to break away. I have seen something striking similar with my brother ....and it drove him to an untimely death.

Will pray for you....🙏

One more thought for you Peaceandcalm about this bit:

She is still reacting like i was the one who did her this horrible wrong by asking her about her affairs. how could i not know her? how could i think she would be capable of this? So much that even now i doubt. i wonder. what if im wrong?

Look up "DARVO". It stand for Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender.

Read about the kind of people who do that, and you’ll have a better understanding of your WW and how she is manipulating you.

It’s been so long since I left my infidelity-relationship that I don’t know if that distance makes this post less relative or even more important seeing as it’s through the lens of time.

I loved my fiancé. The woman I intended to marry 4 weeks and 6 days later when I caught her in bed with another man.

I felt there was something special about it about five years earlier, when we first met. I don’t know if it was love or lust, or if love and lust is the same before you turn 20 or whatever. I do know love as an emotion can change over time and maybe the hardest thing in a marriage is to retain love throughout it all – preferably based on some foundation of lust, but probably also influenced by gratitude, respect and consideration.

What I do know is that I loved her from when I fell in love with her, and I loved her when I left for that night-shift, and I loved her when I walked into that apartment unexpectedly.

I guess I also loved her when I saw them. Just like I loved her when I walked out. Just like I loved her some weeks later, crying alone in my bed. Maybe this wouldn’t have hurt so much if I hadn’t loved her. Maybe I would be all indifferent and mainly focused on the risk of pregnancy and STI and be more concerned about them using a condom, rather than the fact another man was inside the woman of my dreams and future.

I don’t know how long I loved her after we separated. Maybe a month, maybe three, maybe 12. What I realized is that despite my love for her then her actions (and the reasons for her actions) made it impossible for me to remain with her. Love alone didn’t cut it.

I can also share that love that isn’t fed and watered is like a flower that wilts away and eventually dies. If your love for her is totally one sided – as in you loving her and that not being returned – then it’s not love per se, but an infatuation. There were evenings and nights where I would think about her, and want to drive over to see what she might be doing… basically stalking.
Fortunately I had the strength to weather the storm. Go "cold turkey" on her, and eventually the finality of my decision was accepted by the person probably most affected – mainly me.

Did I love her unconditionally? Clearly not. I did not love her enough to still want her in my life while she had hookups with random other men.
Would I have run into a burning building, jumped in front of a gun or… as the poet once said: take a grenade for her? Well… Yes. Just like I would for my wife and my kids. But that’s not unconditional love. That’s just love, with conditions of expected behavior.

I truly think a marriage can’t work out infidelity unless both parties realize that the whole marriage is at risk.
Once you both accept that… You can decide if you want to save it, or if you are OK with it dying.

I think the two of you need to have that talk: Do you want to be married, and can you have a common, shared view on what is required?
I’m guessing that if she stops cheating then at least you have a contained situation that might be dealt with. If she isn’t willing to do that work… well… you have your answer.